question about missing deadlines

[beer]

1: As far as I know a WU that fails will be send to 2 new mashines. Will this also happen when a WU does not meet the deadline?
2: Is stanford collecting information about witch WU that is not comepletet and how far they where before they passed the deadline?

[7im]

1 is not a known rule, nor documented anywhere. Which kind of errors? Eue? NaN? WU interrupted?

But past documentation has said expired wus are only sent out once.

Also, expired WUs are deleted! No information is sent back to PG, other than the fact that WU has to be reassigned. What value would that have? You've already missed two deadlines.

[Jesse_V]

1 is not a known rule, nor documented anywhere. Which kind of errors? Eue? NaN? WU interrupted?

But past documentation has said expired wus are only sent out once.

Also, expired WUs are deleted! No information is sent back to PG, other than the fact that WU has to be reassigned. What value would that have? You've already missed two deadlines.

Hmm. I found a statement by Bruce indicating that WUs which error out will be reassigned to two other people. viewtopic.php?f=59&t=19315#p192836

I also found this post by Bruce where he presumably queried the WU database and found information on how long it took donors to complete the WU, even when it expired. viewtopic.php?f=19&t=21443&p=215016#p215016

[7im]

Yes, I read the same posts (I read almost all posts). Bruce made observations about one specific instance.

But obviously you know folding better than I do, so please, Jesse_V, show us the FAQ documentation where PG states that WUs are sent out twice on EUEs, or three times on NaNs, or four times when the Timeout (pref deadline) has passed, and five times when the (final) Deadline as passed.

You seem to presume a lot, and often...

...and wrongly... Project 7600 has a 13.9 day Timeout. None of those WUs that Bruce researched had expired. They errored out, and were then reassigned.

[7im]

Yes, WUs that have errored out have been observed to be reassigned more than once. But we don't know for sure if that is 2, 3, x number of times. And we don't know for sure on which specific errors that happens. Nor on which, if any or all projects, for any or all clients.

A lot of unknowns... feel free to start keeping a list. It might make it in to an FAQ someday.

[beer]

Also, expired WUs are deleted! No information is sent back to PG, other than the fact that WU has to be reassigned. What value would that have? You've already missed two deadlines.

I was thinking about how far it has progressed. Eks if a lot of WU is at 99% before final dead line then it could have finished if the final deadline has been extended with a little bit. Also if a specific WU keep meeting/passing last deadline it might be a good idear to find out how long they are when they passed it so the final dead line can be adjusted. It is just my tought about it

[iceman1992]

I was thinking about how far it has progressed. Eks if a lot of WU is at 99% before final dead line then it could have finished if the final deadline has been extended with a little bit.

If they keep extending the deadline for WUs, when will it end? Not feasible IMO.

[7im]

Except for the bigadv work units, deadlines have traditionally been very long, so collecting that information was uinhelpful. But things change, and if collecting that info becomes helpful, I think Pande Gruop wouild start doing that.

[bruce]

When a WU times out, I have no information about how far it got unless somebody posts their log. The client does not report that information to the server. I do read the logs that are posted, however.

When a WU errors out, there generally is a report which has a time it was assigned and a time it was reported . . . so we know a fraction of the deadline but not a fraction of the work (since that would depend on hardware speed, which is not known).

I have seen WUs that appeared to have been reissued more than once during the timeout period. I know of no policy -- just reports of uploaded results. Sometimes I see more WUs returned than I expect from the published policy which only mentions being reissued once per expiration of the timeout -- often not. I can't explain it.

The database does not tell me when a WU expires or when it is (re-)issued. There are only reports of CREDITED WUs (including 0 point credits, indicating an error). The time the WU was issued is reported with the credit record but if there is no credit record reported, there's no information about when the expired WU was issued.

Deadlines do not get extended. If your hardware cannot meet the deadlines, the only option available is to switch to a type of WU with longer deadlines. They need WUs to be returned FASTER, not SLOWER. If they were ever to extend the deadline, the AVERAGE return time would grow, diluting a pool of faster hardware with some slower machines.

It should also be noted that WU which timeout will not receive a bonus. That WU is reissued, but that shouldn't stop you from finishing it if your at 99%. You'll still get baseline points which is worth more than the additional 1% that is needed to finish the WU. It's still a good idea to reconfigure so you won't be assigned WUs you can't finish.

[beer]

Deadlines do not get extended. If your hardware cannot meet the deadlines, the only option available is to switch to a type of WU with longer deadlines. They need WUs to be returned FASTER, not SLOWER. If they were ever to extend the deadline, the AVERAGE return time would grow, diluting a pool of faster hardware with some slower machines.

I have convinced ome of my friends and families to start folding. I dont think the are tecnhcal enough to change the type of WU. If a mashines do have a history of not being able to finish a WU becouse of deadlines becouse it is not on long enough I will suggest that it is build into the client to request a Wu with longer deadlines so the users with dont know how to change WU is still able to finish some WU without pasing deadlines

[7im]

This dynamic WU assignment, to send out WU with longer deadlines if a client misses deadlines is a very old request. I think there might have been a V7 feature request about it also.

[beer]

This dynamic WU assignment, to send out WU with longer deadlines if a client misses deadlines is a very old request. I think there might have been a V7 feature request about it also.

I am always to late with good ideas. I hope that feature will make it into v7 at somepoint so we dont waste CPU time on machines that have problem with meeting deadlines