Folding Forum

new08 wrote:PS On the payment for results issue it would be fair to work out a average electricity cost for long term points gained and this could be refunded on Paypal or be donated to a charity of choice by the donor.
I only suggest this as when something is free - it tends to get taken for granted over time. Human nature!
It has cost me some hundreds of $$ over the years to fold on equipment bought second hand on eBay and I am happy to do it for free.
Others may not be,though..or prefer options as I mentioned.

We are paid in points.. Not valuable I hear? Well try reducing them and see the outcry These points seem to be very valuable indeed, so valuable that people spend money sometimes lots to earn them. OK so many people don't care about the points or only care a little about the points. But there is no denying they are a currency of sort, just one not fully tradable (at present). Paying donators for electricity? Well they are donators, in this they donate their cost be it hardware or the cost for the juice to run it.
If Pande was to pay for this well why not just buy the hardware as well and forget about distributed computing.

kiore wrote:If Pande was to pay for this well why not just buy the hardware as well and forget about distributed computing.

Hardware costs are not negligible, nor is physical storage space (a computer or two takes up negligible space in a house, all of them in one location would not). They'd also likely have to hire more people for tech support to run and troubleshoot all that hardware. I'm not saying paying people is necessarily feasible, but paying for people's power is on some level more feasible than paying for everything associated with that computing power.

That's it Zagen- capital costs written off in advance and revenue limited to fuel costs only, as a sweetener, to keep people folding [or even to start].
Maybe donors don't initially realise the true cost of folding and unremittingly drop out..
That's what the OP is looking at!

Friendly advice - never ever build computer(s) for the only purpose of running FAH on it. Down the road you will likely regret that. It basically boils down to the fact that your goals will not align well with the PG goals and only hurt party out of such clash is you. Just run the FAH additionally to your usual stuff and you'll be happy bunny.

Nothing wrong with joint aims though, Ivo!
I upgraded using ebay bits to improve folding 10x and run it as a general purpose PC too. It does this fine. Streams video while 100% cores on SMP and the NV GPU flat out doing just over a minute/step on 353 pointers. 6-7Kpd on about 300watts or so...[when run full time]
Going overboard for huge increases for F@H is probably as you say, a mistake, but technically there's no reason that specs can't merge happily as with mine.

Ivoshiee wrote:Friendly advice - never ever build computer(s) for the only purpose of running FAH on it. Down the road you will likely regret that. It basically boils down to the fact that your goals will not align well with the PG goals and only hurt party out of such clash is you. Just run the FAH additionally to your usual stuff and you'll be happy bunny.

So, are you saying I should sell all the comps I put together just to fold with so I don't regret it?

new08 wrote:Nothing wrong with joint aims though, Ivo!
I upgraded using ebay bits to improve folding 10x and run it as a general purpose PC too. It does this fine. Streams video while 100% cores on SMP
and the NV GPU flat out doing just over a minute on 353 pointers. 6-7Kpd on about 300watts or so...
Going overboard for huge increases for F@H is probably as you say, a mistake, but technically there's no reason that specs can't merge happily as with mine.

Everything is fine if you do it knowingly and will not expect any special return for you personally from the project.

Which is why I said, I'm a gamer first and a folder second. It just so happens that it makes my PC(s) scream at Folding, too, is all.

Friendly advice - never ever build computer(s) for the only purpose of running FAH on it. Down the road you will likely regret that.

Do what's appropriate for your own priorities, budget, and sense of charity.

Some of us have been Folding since the project started nearly 12 years ago, and have built many systems exclusively for Folding. I understand that for some people, Folding is a casual matter. That's certainly fine, to each his own. For some of us, Folding is a passion and a charity, in which participation returns a deep sense of satisfaction.

For those on a limited budget and whose main pursuit is gaming, then, I suppose, your advice is appropriate.

I suspect from what's been said over time that PG prefer bigger ,more dedicated folders than slow, intermittent and even careless folders- though they all contribute. The quality of results has been said to rely on consistent,quick turn round and not overclocked folding.This doesn't match every stretched system, tbh.
I reckon some big donors are paying a LOT of power costs to produce 1M+ ppd , and many others can't afford to do this, apart from equipment build and maintaining.
There's a lot of policy decisions made at the top of F@H that we hear nothing about on the shop floor. This makes the project slightly remote from potential donors who are not sure what they are contributing to, even wanting a quick 'charity buzz'. Found not to be so totally cheap , as I said earlier.
The MAIN thing is- it DOES work and produces results that can be firmed up later, if need be.

PG has nothing against overclocking. Faster is always better.

OC is only a problem when people wrongly assume that fah crashed a system, instead of unstable clock speeds.

Overclocked is a matter of subjectivity.
What is the difference between a CPU For instance FX-4100 and a FX-4170 other than the factory supplied multiplier setting?
A 4100 can be changed to the speed of a 4170 real quick.
They still are the same chip, just a different factory setting for more $$.
IF F@H wants everyone to use just the same bench set-up as they use I will be out of here for BIONIC of some other DC that doesn't mind innovation.
If it wasn't for innovation and the need for speed or to excel we wouldn't have 4P systems working for the cause.

Now unstable OC'd systems is another topic.

7im wrote:PG has nothing against overclocking. Faster is always better.

Pleased to hear it ,7im-
But I have seen strictures against OC at various times on F@H discussions- or PG set up tips..
My system is naturally flat out ;~)

Mod edit to fix quote tags. ~sorto'

It would be beneficial to the discussion, new08, if you could provide links to the posts to which you refer. It would help to have the benefit of actual words posted and author(s), as well as context.

Sorry, Geek- I'm not going to trawl back/dig down.
The general drift of discussion is in favour of stable OC'ing in this thread -and that is the main thing. [Context]
I can't be the only one with this impression that OC has been frowned on from time to time.
It seems a side issue, anyway to the general thread topic.